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  #1  
Old 01-25-2016, 07:42 PM
Loch Loch is offline
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xs11 self cancel turn signal

self-cancel system problem. ive followed the not working procedure. did not fix, then I augmented wires, added braided grounds from batt to frame and engine block,and still the system works perfectly or not at all.
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Old 01-25-2016, 08:51 PM
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From experience I would say the reed switch in the speedometer is flakey.

If you have a fairing the plug can cause that issue too. My fairing plug needs to be cleaned and tightened. Sometimes the signals work fine and cancel OK but sometimes they'll wok fine and won't cancel.......and sometimes they'll just come on and won't blink. Wiggle the plug to the fairing and they work fine.

Sometimes I'm a lazy a$$ and don't fix stuff.
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  #3  
Old 01-25-2016, 08:58 PM
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Radioguylogs Radioguylogs is offline
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Reed Switch?

The reed switch in the speedometer causes problems for a lot of folks:

http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread.php?t=33221

Try searching "reed" or "self cancelling"

All of mine are intermittent, so it's on my 'to do' list.
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  #4  
Old 01-26-2016, 01:54 AM
crazy steve crazy steve is offline
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If the reed switch is bad, the system just won't cancel; it sounds like an intermittent connection at the cancel module. Next time it doesn't work, try unplugging the module. If the system now flashes (but won't cancel), the problem is in the plug connection or the module (probably the plug).
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Last edited by crazy steve; 01-27-2016 at 12:32 AM.
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Old 01-26-2016, 06:29 AM
TADracer TADracer is offline
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I'm no electrical guru but also look and see if your bike still has an OEM flasher unit. As I recall, aftermarket flashers will upset the self-cancelling but I am not 100% sure about this. Perhaps others will chime in.
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  #6  
Old 01-26-2016, 07:39 PM
Loch Loch is offline
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intermitent flasher cancel

I don't have a fairing, iv used 3 flasher cancel units 2 factory and 1 after market relays, supplemented the harness bypassing the connections, and 3 reed switches,
how does the cancel signal cancel the flasher?
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Old 01-26-2016, 07:46 PM
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Have you tried switching out the canceler unit under the seat? It might just be a corroded connection there.
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80 SG Ol' Okie;79 engine & carbs w/pods, 45 pilots, 140 mains, Custom Mac 4 into 2 exhaust, ACCT,XS850 final drive,110/90/19 front tire,TKat fork brace, XS750 140 MPH speedometer, Vetter IV fairing, aftermarket hard bags and trunk, LG high back seat, XJ rear shocks.

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  #8  
Old 01-27-2016, 02:08 AM
crazy steve crazy steve is offline
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How The OEM Turn Signals Work

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven_Loch View Post
....how does the cancel signal cancel the flasher?
The XS turn signals are unlike any other turn signals circuits you've ever ran into. The flasher isn't really a flasher, it's a special relay and the canceller prevents the relay from closing under specific conditions, turning the signals 'off' (but not really...). Here's how it works....

Let's assume the canceller module is unplugged; note that the signals will work with it out of the circuit, it just won't cancel and you have to turn them off manually.

First, the 'flasher' is really a relay, not a bi-metal set of contacts like you'll find everywhere else.

So what happens when you move the turn switch to the left or right? Power is always supplied to the 'hot' side of the relay, moving the switch closes contacts, applying power through the relay to the lights, and providing a ground path to complete the circuit. The lever returns to center, but the contacts remain closed. Power starts to flow into the relay coil from the brown wire, but there's a delay as there's a capacitor connected in parallel with the relay coil. The coil doesn't 'pull in' (close the contacts) until the capacitor is fully charged. Once the capacitor is charged, then the full current/voltage is applied to the relay coil, the contacts close, the lights come on through the brown/white wire, and the capacitor discharges, starting the cycle over. The capacitor is the reason changing any of the lamps from the OEM sizes causes the system to not work correctly or not at all. You must have the specific load for the capacitor to charge properly. I'll note that these relays rarely fail, it's usually another reason if the turns don't work. But when they do fail, they're expensive to replace.

So assuming everything is correct and you have good connections everywhere, your turns are flashing. You have to manually turn them off by pushing the switch lever 'in', which opens the circuit. Remember, the cancel module isn't plugged in.

So how does the cancel module work? There's some electronic wizardry inside that, but we can infer functions by it's inputs and outputs. So you move the switch left or right. Everything I outlined above takes place, but now several other things occur. First, when you move the switch, another separate set of contacts close, but these are momentary contacts. Note that the cancel module also has an always-hot power supply wire going to it. Closing these contacts grounds an input to the flasher unit, 'resetting' it. The lights start flashing and meanwhile the reed switch in the speedometer starts 'counting' distance. The module uses these 'counts' to calculate both speed and distance (how specifically this is done is unknown), with lower speeds generally meaning the signal will stay on longer. They should remain on if stopped (although some modules will turn 'off' after considerable time). After the module has decided that the turns have been on long enough, voltage is sent out from the yellow/green wire to the flasher. This wire applies a 'counter voltage' to the capacitor, preventing it from fully charging so that the relay contacts can't close, and the lights stop flashing and go out. Note that the turn signals aren't actually 'off', merely prevented from flashing. Moving the switch left or right 'resets' the module, and the cycle starts over.

It's really a quite reliable system, but it is VERY sensitive to load, so poor connections and/or different lamps can cause it not to work. If you're having issues with it flashing, unplug the cancel module before doing any troubleshooting. Get it working without the module first, then you can troubleshoot cancel issues. Poor connections in the module plug or a bad module WILL cause the system to not work at all, even if you have it working without it. If it works but doesn't cancel, it can be either the module or the reed switch in the speedo. You can replace the relay 'flasher' with a standard bi-metal flasher or LED flasher (using the brown and brown/white wires) if it's bad or are changing lamp types/sizes, but to retain the self-cancel feature you need to perform this mod.... http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread.php?t=39871

There it is.....
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Fast, Cheap, Reliable... Pick any two

'78E original owner - resto project
'78E ???? owner - Modder project FJ forks, 4-piston calipers F/R, 160/80-16 rear tire
'82 XJ rebuild project
'80SG restified, red SOLD
'79F parts...
'81H more parts...

Other current bikes:
'93 XL1200 Anniversary Sportster 85RWHP
'86 XL883/1200 Chopper
'82 XL1000 w/1450cc Buell, Baker 6-speed, in-progress project
Cage: '13 Mustang GT/CS with a few 'custom' touches
Yep, can't leave nuthin' alone...

Last edited by crazy steve; 01-27-2016 at 02:20 AM.
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  #9  
Old 01-27-2016, 09:10 AM
TADracer TADracer is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crazy steve View Post
The XS turn signals are unlike any other turn signals circuits you've ever ran into. The flasher isn't really a flasher, it's a special relay and the canceller prevents the relay from closing under specific conditions, turning the signals 'off' (but not really...). Here's how it works....

.................
Interesting. But who dreams this stuff up?

Brings back memories of the movie 1941 when the Japanese are taking Slim Pickens down into the submarine with his big round-top radio and it will not fit through the hatch. One of them says in Japanese "We have to figure out how to make these things smaller".
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  #10  
Old 01-28-2016, 06:09 AM
Loch Loch is offline
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intermitent self cancel problem xs11

I believe I have solved the problem. I cleaned corrosion off the turn flasher cover and the switch contact, then recrimped the cover back on.
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Old 01-28-2016, 06:42 PM
Loch Loch is offline
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self cancel problem xs11

NO JOY!
I did not find the solution. I may be getting closer, it works more than not.
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  #12  
Old 01-28-2016, 06:47 PM
motoman motoman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven_Loch View Post
NO JOY!
I did not find the solution. I may be getting closer, it works more than not.
Likely a voltage drop through the igmition switch OR kill switch.
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  #13  
Old 02-11-2016, 10:40 AM
mikubuilder mikubuilder is offline
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Mine usually quits working after a long riding, so I'm guessing it's overheating.
Steve's explanation of the system also resolves my issue of turns coming on after parking and shutting off... I guess more cleaning is in order
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Old 02-11-2016, 03:35 PM
timktm timktm is offline
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On this subject, does anyone know of a testing procedure for the reed switch? I have my speedo out and I want to test it before I put it back together.
Tim
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  #15  
Old 02-11-2016, 06:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timktm View Post
On this subject, does anyone know of a testing procedure for the reed switch? I have my speedo out and I want to test it before I put it back together.
Tim
Not sure but I think just a magnet and an ohm meter would suffice. Never tried it though.
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Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.

― Albert Einstein

80 SG Ol' Okie;79 engine & carbs w/pods, 45 pilots, 140 mains, Custom Mac 4 into 2 exhaust, ACCT,XS850 final drive,110/90/19 front tire,TKat fork brace, XS750 140 MPH speedometer, Vetter IV fairing, aftermarket hard bags and trunk, LG high back seat, XJ rear shocks.

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